Iranian navy to launch destroyer

[Bosnian]

http://www.gulf-daily-news.com/Story.asp?Article=179581&Sn=WORL&IssueID=30029

Iranian navy to launch destroyer

TEHRAN: Iran's navy plans to launch the first Iranian-built destroyer soon, the official Irna news agency quoted a naval commander as saying yesterday.

The announcement in the Gulf port of Bandar Abbas comes at a time of growing tension between Iran and the West over Tehran's nuclear programme, which Washington and others suspect is a cover for making atom bombs. Tehran denies the charge.

"Soon the first Iranian-made destroyer will be launched ...and will surprise the world's military community with its facilities, equipment, capabilities and technology," commander Darioush Ebrahimnejad said.

He called it one of the most modern ships of its kind in the world, but did not give details or say when it would be officially unveiled. Destroyers are fast warships with guns and torpedoes used to protect other ships.

Last month, state television said Iran's navy had held more than a week of war games in the Gulf using tactical submarines and small vessels carrying missile launchers.

The exercises were the latest in a series of manoeuvres staged by Iran's military in the Gulf.

Although Iran may not have the technology to match that of US forces, experts say it could still cause trouble for shipping in the Gulf and disrupt flows of crude in the waterway, through which 40 per cent of the world's traded oil is shipped.

[Voyager]

I truly wonder how much of that is iranian made,but even if its 20% its still a amazing acomplishment for iran .

[Alex]

great news. i hope the will launch it and not delay it any further.

[Janbaz]

I truly wonder how much of that is iranian made,but even if its 20% its still a amazing acomplishment for iran .

It's alot more than 20%.
The things that are NOT made in Iran are Engine and some electronics but not all electronics.

[Technicaldeathstrike]

wow this kind of good news.

can I see that ships photos?

[payam]

@ Voyager
brother as i know and as i have information we have the the whole 6 leavels of technology for making a navy in iran
its exaclly home made.....i cant calim 100% iranian technology ofcource,but its home made,

[ironbar]

It's alot more than 20%.
The things that are NOT made in Iran are Engine and some electronics but not all electronics.

ITS A REBUILT US DESTROYER FRON THE TIME OF THE SHA THAT WAS DAMAGED DURING THE WAR WITH IRAK AND JUST RECENTLY REPAIRED
NOT NEW

[payam]

ironbar what are u talking about?read the topic again..thanks

[Janbaz]

ITS A REBUILT US DESTROYER FRON THE TIME OF THE SHA THAT WAS DAMAGED DURING THE WAR WITH IRAK AND JUST RECENTLY REPAIRED
NOT NEW

Wrong. Most likely this would be the Second Mowj Class destroyer that would be launched in Caspean sea.
Also, I would post a new picture of Iranian stealth Fast Boat. This Boat is awsom looking. In a few days you all would see it.

[jawwal]

Stealthy fast boats would be a great addition to the iranian navy..

[Janbaz]

As I promised ealier. Here is the picture of Iranian Stealth Boat. It is low torpeado launch boat. This picture was posted on ACIG.org forum as well.

http://www.s188567700.online.de/forum/files/thumbs/t_stealthboat1a7ad_102.jpg


http://img150.imageshack.us/img150/2950/stealthboat1px8.png

[IR.IRAN]

great news and great pictures janbaz.

[jawwal]

They look great, and surely would perform even better, i believe they have missile boats this size too against ships, ,donot know if they are stealthy too though..

[Technicaldeathstrike]

nice ship picture.

[Janbaz]

The next Generation of Iranian Stealth Boat are very similar to this Itallian Boat but not exact copy.

http://www.s188567700.online.de/forum/files/thumbs/t_inspiration3_182.jpg

[Technicaldeathstrike]

The next Generation of Iranian Stealth Boat are very similar to this Itallian Boat but not exact copy.

http://www.s188567700.online.de/forum/files/thumbs/t_inspiration3_182.jpg

those stealth boats looks very beautiful than usual boats...what things they arm?

[JEskandari]

those stealth boats looks very beautiful than usual boats...what things they arm?
probably torpedoes and small missile like c-802

[Prinz Eugen]

The next Generation of Iranian Stealth Boat are very similar to this Itallian Boat but not exact copy.

http://www.s188567700.online.de/forum/files/thumbs/t_inspiration3_182.jpg



That’s false..
That picture shows a Wally, that an civil luxury yacht.
http://www.wally.com/jumpch.asp?idChannel=44&idUser=0&attivo=2-5

This is not stealthy or for military use.
For 100% this is not how the next Iranian missile boat will look like.

[Janbaz]

That’s false..
That picture shows a Wally, that an civil luxury yacht.
http://www.wally.com/jumpch.asp?idChannel=44&idUser=0&attivo=2-5

This is not stealthy or for military use.
For 100% this is not how the next Iranian missile boat will look like.

You don't read the post. this is what I said to repeat it for you:

The next Generation of Iranian Stealth Boat are very similar to this Itallian Boat but not exact copy.

[Janbaz]

Researchers Build Micro-Submarines
TEHRAN, May 23--Researchers at the University of Tehran have built two types of micro-submarines, the project director said Wednesday.
Aqil Yousefi-Koma added that the two submarines can be used in reconnaissance and rescue operations as well as for monitoring the health of marine structures and suicide bombing, ISNA reported.
Yousefi-Koma said these submarines can also simulate the movement of marine animals.
“Today, robots and underwater vehicles are devised by simulating aquatic animals. This simulation will boost the efficiency of robots and reduce the possibility of interception by enemy radars,“ he said.
The researcher noted that advanced software programs were used for simulating the movements of sharks, adding that the project is aimed at building unmanned submarines with a lower probability of interception.
Yousefi-Koma noted that each submarine weighs 1,100 grams and has been tested successfully.

http://www.iran-daily.com/1386/2851/html/ (http://www.iran-daily.com/1386/2851/html/)

http://64.40.99.49/Multimedia/pics/1386/3/Science/12.jpg

[PERSPOLIS]

what is that ship at .23 seconds ?

can it carry helicopter ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g-qKXPVgdH4&mode=related&search=

[wmac]

Is there any specification available of the destroyer?

I think we need a survey article on Iranian industrial capabilities in this section (including ship building industries) . Anyone aware of a complete survey report?

siamak

[Kermanshah1]

Good news, finally a proper destroyer. All Irans 3 destroyers are over 50 years old and served in WW2, the Korean War and Vietnam War. 2 of them have retired and 1 isn't used for combat anymore.

[PERSPOLIS]

http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/world/russia/2038-pics.htm

does iran have or buying any of

Project 2038.0 Steregushchy Corvette
In April 2001, Russia Navy Commander-in-Chief, Adm Vladimir Kuroyedov, stated that the Navy was starting construction of the new Project 2038.0 corvette. These ships are designed for coastal patrol, escort and antisubmarine warfare operations. The first of class was scheduled to be laid down at the Severnaya Verf shipyard in St Petersburg in late 2001. The design of this 1,900 ton stealthy corvette was developed by the Almaz Central Marine Design bureau. Almaz was chosen over six other competitors to develop the Project 2038.0 class.

This is apparently the first concrete indication of the fact of the existence of this previously un-attested project. The Almaz Central Marine Design Bureau is a leading builder of patrol craft that served with the border guard forces and customs service. In 1997 the Almaz Central Marine Design Bureau mentioned work on a project for a new multi-role frigate, enabling any country to build a Navy capable of protecting its economic interests. According to the Almaz CMDB, a ship of this type must:

have a cruising range of up to 10,000 miles;
have an endurance of up to 60 days;
have facilities to carry out electronic monitoring of warships, vessels and aircraft;
have small boats to carry inspection teams;
carry a helicopter;
have facilities to monitor the environment;
be armed to fire warning shots and conduct fire for effect against trespassers;
chase intruder ships at a speed of 20 to 25 knots;
have equipment to reel in and store illegal fishing equipment on board;

[PERSPOLIS]

iran is caught from all sides....


China's pearl in Pakistan's waters
By Sudha Ramachandran

BANGALORE - When Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao visits Pakistan this month to inaugurate the Gwadar deepsea port, China will take a giant leap forward in gaining a strategic foothold in the Persian Gulf region. It will advance what a recent Pentagon report describes as Beijing's "string of pearls" strategy that aims to project Chinese power overseas and protect China's energy security at home.

Gwadar is a fishing village on the Arabian Sea coast in the Pakistani province of Balochistan. Balochistan shares borders with Afghanistan and Iran to the west - Gwadar is just 72 kilometers from the Iranian border. More important is Gwadar's proximity to the Persian Gulf. It is situated near the mouth of this strategic body of water, and about 400km from the Strait of Hormuz, a major conduit for global oil supplies.

Pakistan identified Gwadar as a port site in 1964. However, it was only in 2001 that significant steps toward making the proposal a reality were taken, when China agreed to participate in the construction and development of the deepsea port. The arrival of the United States in late 2001 in Afghanistan - at China's doorstep - nudged Beijing to step up its involvement in the Gwadar project. In March 2002, Chinese vice premier Wu Bangguo laid the foundation for Gwadar port.

China's involvement in the Gwadar project is immense. The total cost of the project is estimated at US$1.16 billion, of which China has contributed about $198 million for the first phase - almost four times the amount Pakistan has forked out for this phase - which includes construction of three multi-purpose ship berths. China has invested another $200 million toward building a highway connecting Gwadar port with Pakistan's largest city, Karachi, which is also a port on the Arabian Sea.

The second phase, which envisages nine more berths, an approach channel and storage terminals, will also be financed by China. In addition to its financial contribution, China has sent about 450 engineers and provided technical expertise for the project.

In recent years, bilateral trade has steadily increased between China and Pakistan, with a 35% rise to $2.4 billion in 2004, half the trade volume registered between China and India. The balance of trade remains overwhelmingly in China's favor, whose exports amounted to $1.8 billion compared with Pakistan's $575 million. Both Pakistan and China have highlighted the immense economic returns that development of the Gwadar port holds out for the two countries, as well as others in the region.

For Pakistan, the economic returns from Gwadar port stem from its location near the Strait of Hormuz, through which 40% of the world's oil passes. Gwadar could emerge as a key shipping point, bringing Pakistan much-needed income, and when combined with the surrounding areas could become a trade hub, once road and rail links connect it to the rest of Pakistan, Afghanistan and Central Asia.

A road from Gwadar to Saindak, said to be the shortest route between Central Asia and the sea, is under construction. Gwadar would provide landlocked Afghanistan and the Central Asian republics with access to the sea. Goods and oil and gas reserves from these countries could be shipped to global markets through Gwadar port. Pakistan's business community seems to be in favor of Gwadar port being designated a free trade zone and an export-processing zone.

The development of Gwadar could bring economic gains to backward Balochistan province as well. The infrastructural development of the province could make it an attractive investment destination. Meanwhile, land prices around Gwadar are said to be shooting up.

China's gains
Zia Haider, an analyst at the Washington-based Stimson Center, writes that Gwadar provides China "a transit terminal for crude-oil imports from Iran and Africa to China's Xinjiang region". The network of rail and road links connecting Pakistan with Afghanistan and Central Asian republics that is envisaged as part of the Gwadar project and to which China will have access would provide Beijing an opening into Central Asian markets and energy sources, in the process stimulating the economic development of China's backward Xinjiang region.

But it is the strategic significance of Gwadar port that is perhaps more important for Pakistan and China - and a number of other countries as well. For Pakistan, Gwadar's distance from India is important. The value of this distance becomes evident if one considers how vulnerable Karachi port, which handled 90% of Pakistan's sea-borne trade in 2001, is to Indian pressure.

During the 1971 India-Pakistan war, India's blockade of Karachi had a serious impact on the Pakistani economy. Again in 1999, during the Kargil conflict, India threatened to blockade Karachi port. That Gwadar is situated 725km to the west of Karachi, which makes it 725km further away from India than Karachi, provides "Pakistan with crucial strategic depth [vis-a-vis India] along its coastline", writes Haider.

For China, Gwadar's strategic value stems from its proximity to the Strait of Hormuz. About 60% of China's energy supplies come from the Middle East, and China has been anxious that the US, which has a very high presence in the region, could choke off these supplies to China. "Having no blue-water navy to speak of, China feels defenseless in the Persian Gulf against any hostile action to choke off its energy supplies," points out Tarique Niazi, a specialist in resource-based conflict, in the Jamestown Foundation's China Brief.

A presence in Gwadar provides China with a "listening post" where it can "monitor US naval activity in the Persian Gulf, Indian activity in the Arabian Sea and future US-Indian maritime cooperation in the Indian Ocean", writes Haider. A recent report titled "Energy Futures in Asia" produced by defense contractor Booz Allen Hamilton for the Pentagon notes that China has already set up electronic eavesdropping posts at Gwadar, which are monitoring maritime traffic through the Strait of Hormuz and the Arabian Sea.

Drawing attention to China's "string of pearls" strategy, the report points out that "China is building strategic relationships along the sea lanes from the Middle East to the South China Sea in ways that suggest defensive and offensive positioning to protect China's energy interests, but also to serve broad security objectives". The port and naval base in Gwadar is part of the "string of pearls".

The other "pearls" in the string include facilities in Bangladesh, Myanmar, Thailand, Cambodia and the South China Sea that Beijing has acquired access to by assiduously building ties with governments in these countries.

The Pentagon report sees China's efforts to defend its interests along oil shipping sea lanes as "creating a climate of uncertainty" and threatening "the safety of all ships on the high seas". This perception overlooks the fact that China's "string of pearls" strategy has been triggered by its sense of insecurity. The United States' overwhelming presence in the Gulf and the control of its exercises over the Malacca Strait, through which 80% of China's oil imports pass, has contributed enormously to Beijing's fears that Washington could choke off its oil supply, in the event of hostilities over Taiwan.

China's foothold in the Arabian Sea has set off alarm bells in India, Iran and the US. For India, China-Pakistan collaboration at Gwadar and China's presence in the Arabian Sea heightens its feeling of encirclement by China from all sides. Iran sees the development of Gwadar port in its neighborhood as likely to erode the significance of its ports - especially Chabahar port that India has helped construct - to Central Asia and Afghanistan. However, Iran's good relations with Afghanistan and the Central Asian republics would help it maintain its advantage vis-a-vis Pakistan's Gwadar port.

Ultimately, the extent to which Pakistan and China are able to reap economic and strategic gains from the Gwadar project would depend on the challenges to it from within their borders. The Gwadar project is bitterly opposed by Baloch nationalists who see it as yet another example of Pakistan's Punjabi-dominated ruling elite siphoning away Balochi wealth and resources without this backward region or its people gaining.

For instance, it is non-Balochis who are said to have gained from the sharp rise in real estate prices around Gwadar. This has, not surprisingly, triggered angry and violent attacks on pipelines carrying oil from Balochistan and on those working on the Gwadar project. Last May, three Chinese engineers were killed and 11 others, including nine Chinese and two Pakistanis, were injured in a bomb attack by the Balochistan Liberation Army.

Pakistan has often blamed "a foreign hand" (read India or Iran) for the violence in Balochistan. But the threat to the port project or the oil pipelines comes from disaffected Balochis. Similarly, Uighur separatists angry with Beijing's "Hanification" of their land, could target Chinese workers at Gwadar.

Unless Islamabad ensures that the Baloch people have a sizeable share of the prosperity that is expected to come from Gwadar port, and Beijing ensures that the Uighurs gain from the trade with Central Asia, both Pakistan and China could find the scale of their economic and strategic ambitions diminished.

Sudha Ramachandran is an independent journalist/researcher based in Bangalore.

(Copyright 2005 Asia Times Online Ltd. All rights reserved. Please contact us for information on sales, syndication and republishing.)

[Kermanshah1]

iran is caught from all sides....


China's pearl in Pakistan's waters
By Sudha Ramachandran

BANGALORE - When Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao visits Pakistan this month to inaugurate the Gwadar deepsea port, China will take a giant leap forward in gaining a strategic foothold in the Persian Gulf region. It will advance what a recent Pentagon report describes as Beijing's "string of pearls" strategy that aims to project Chinese power overseas and protect China's energy security at home.

Gwadar is a fishing village on the Arabian Sea coast in the Pakistani province of Balochistan. Balochistan shares borders with Afghanistan and Iran to the west - Gwadar is just 72 kilometers from the Iranian border. More important is Gwadar's proximity to the Persian Gulf. It is situated near the mouth of this strategic body of water, and about 400km from the Strait of Hormuz, a major conduit for global oil supplies.

Pakistan identified Gwadar as a port site in 1964. However, it was only in 2001 that significant steps toward making the proposal a reality were taken, when China agreed to participate in the construction and development of the deepsea port. The arrival of the United States in late 2001 in Afghanistan - at China's doorstep - nudged Beijing to step up its involvement in the Gwadar project. In March 2002, Chinese vice premier Wu Bangguo laid the foundation for Gwadar port.

China's involvement in the Gwadar project is immense. The total cost of the project is estimated at US$1.16 billion, of which China has contributed about $198 million for the first phase - almost four times the amount Pakistan has forked out for this phase - which includes construction of three multi-purpose ship berths. China has invested another $200 million toward building a highway connecting Gwadar port with Pakistan's largest city, Karachi, which is also a port on the Arabian Sea.

The second phase, which envisages nine more berths, an approach channel and storage terminals, will also be financed by China. In addition to its financial contribution, China has sent about 450 engineers and provided technical expertise for the project.

In recent years, bilateral trade has steadily increased between China and Pakistan, with a 35% rise to $2.4 billion in 2004, half the trade volume registered between China and India. The balance of trade remains overwhelmingly in China's favor, whose exports amounted to $1.8 billion compared with Pakistan's $575 million. Both Pakistan and China have highlighted the immense economic returns that development of the Gwadar port holds out for the two countries, as well as others in the region.

For Pakistan, the economic returns from Gwadar port stem from its location near the Strait of Hormuz, through which 40% of the world's oil passes. Gwadar could emerge as a key shipping point, bringing Pakistan much-needed income, and when combined with the surrounding areas could become a trade hub, once road and rail links connect it to the rest of Pakistan, Afghanistan and Central Asia.

A road from Gwadar to Saindak, said to be the shortest route between Central Asia and the sea, is under construction. Gwadar would provide landlocked Afghanistan and the Central Asian republics with access to the sea. Goods and oil and gas reserves from these countries could be shipped to global markets through Gwadar port. Pakistan's business community seems to be in favor of Gwadar port being designated a free trade zone and an export-processing zone.

The development of Gwadar could bring economic gains to backward Balochistan province as well. The infrastructural development of the province could make it an attractive investment destination. Meanwhile, land prices around Gwadar are said to be shooting up.

China's gains
Zia Haider, an analyst at the Washington-based Stimson Center, writes that Gwadar provides China "a transit terminal for crude-oil imports from Iran and Africa to China's Xinjiang region". The network of rail and road links connecting Pakistan with Afghanistan and Central Asian republics that is envisaged as part of the Gwadar project and to which China will have access would provide Beijing an opening into Central Asian markets and energy sources, in the process stimulating the economic development of China's backward Xinjiang region.

But it is the strategic significance of Gwadar port that is perhaps more important for Pakistan and China - and a number of other countries as well. For Pakistan, Gwadar's distance from India is important. The value of this distance becomes evident if one considers how vulnerable Karachi port, which handled 90% of Pakistan's sea-borne trade in 2001, is to Indian pressure.

During the 1971 India-Pakistan war, India's blockade of Karachi had a serious impact on the Pakistani economy. Again in 1999, during the Kargil conflict, India threatened to blockade Karachi port. That Gwadar is situated 725km to the west of Karachi, which makes it 725km further away from India than Karachi, provides "Pakistan with crucial strategic depth [vis-a-vis India] along its coastline", writes Haider.

For China, Gwadar's strategic value stems from its proximity to the Strait of Hormuz. About 60% of China's energy supplies come from the Middle East, and China has been anxious that the US, which has a very high presence in the region, could choke off these supplies to China. "Having no blue-water navy to speak of, China feels defenseless in the Persian Gulf against any hostile action to choke off its energy supplies," points out Tarique Niazi, a specialist in resource-based conflict, in the Jamestown Foundation's China Brief.

A presence in Gwadar provides China with a "listening post" where it can "monitor US naval activity in the Persian Gulf, Indian activity in the Arabian Sea and future US-Indian maritime cooperation in the Indian Ocean", writes Haider. A recent report titled "Energy Futures in Asia" produced by defense contractor Booz Allen Hamilton for the Pentagon notes that China has already set up electronic eavesdropping posts at Gwadar, which are monitoring maritime traffic through the Strait of Hormuz and the Arabian Sea.

Drawing attention to China's "string of pearls" strategy, the report points out that "China is building strategic relationships along the sea lanes from the Middle East to the South China Sea in ways that suggest defensive and offensive positioning to protect China's energy interests, but also to serve broad security objectives". The port and naval base in Gwadar is part of the "string of pearls".

The other "pearls" in the string include facilities in Bangladesh, Myanmar, Thailand, Cambodia and the South China Sea that Beijing has acquired access to by assiduously building ties with governments in these countries.

The Pentagon report sees China's efforts to defend its interests along oil shipping sea lanes as "creating a climate of uncertainty" and threatening "the safety of all ships on the high seas". This perception overlooks the fact that China's "string of pearls" strategy has been triggered by its sense of insecurity. The United States' overwhelming presence in the Gulf and the control of its exercises over the Malacca Strait, through which 80% of China's oil imports pass, has contributed enormously to Beijing's fears that Washington could choke off its oil supply, in the event of hostilities over Taiwan.

China's foothold in the Arabian Sea has set off alarm bells in India, Iran and the US. For India, China-Pakistan collaboration at Gwadar and China's presence in the Arabian Sea heightens its feeling of encirclement by China from all sides. Iran sees the development of Gwadar port in its neighborhood as likely to erode the significance of its ports - especially Chabahar port that India has helped construct - to Central Asia and Afghanistan. However, Iran's good relations with Afghanistan and the Central Asian republics would help it maintain its advantage vis-a-vis Pakistan's Gwadar port.

Ultimately, the extent to which Pakistan and China are able to reap economic and strategic gains from the Gwadar project would depend on the challenges to it from within their borders. The Gwadar project is bitterly opposed by Baloch nationalists who see it as yet another example of Pakistan's Punjabi-dominated ruling elite siphoning away Balochi wealth and resources without this backward region or its people gaining.

For instance, it is non-Balochis who are said to have gained from the sharp rise in real estate prices around Gwadar. This has, not surprisingly, triggered angry and violent attacks on pipelines carrying oil from Balochistan and on those working on the Gwadar project. Last May, three Chinese engineers were killed and 11 others, including nine Chinese and two Pakistanis, were injured in a bomb attack by the Balochistan Liberation Army.

Pakistan has often blamed "a foreign hand" (read India or Iran) for the violence in Balochistan. But the threat to the port project or the oil pipelines comes from disaffected Balochis. Similarly, Uighur separatists angry with Beijing's "Hanification" of their land, could target Chinese workers at Gwadar.

Unless Islamabad ensures that the Baloch people have a sizeable share of the prosperity that is expected to come from Gwadar port, and Beijing ensures that the Uighurs gain from the trade with Central Asia, both Pakistan and China could find the scale of their economic and strategic ambitions diminished.

Sudha Ramachandran is an independent journalist/researcher based in Bangalore.

(Copyright 2005 Asia Times Online Ltd. All rights reserved. Please contact us for information on sales, syndication and republishing.)

So, what has this got to do with Iran?

[PERSPOLIS]

if someone from 1000s of miles buit a base in another country 70 miles away from you , then it has nothing to do with you .

Is this your logic? :huh2:

[Kermanshah1]

if someone from 1000s of miles buit a base in another country 70 miles away from you , then it has nothing to do with you .

Is this your logic? :huh2:

The base might be 70 miles away from Iran but os what. China isn't planning to attack Iran, America is. This is built for China to make sure America doesn't cut of their supplies so this has something to do with China, Pakistan, India and America.

[Oriellien]

What will the destroyer be used for?

[PERSPOLIS]

The base might be 70 miles away from Iran but os what. China isn't planning to attack Iran, America is. This is built for China to make sure America doesn't cut of their supplies so this has something to do with China, Pakistan, India and America.

and that is As Far As U Know!!

[PERSPOLIS]

England, China, Pakistan, Iran, Lebenon, H Bolah, Palestine, Hamas, Sudan

are Encircling the Middle East.

Pakistan Taleban Saudi Arabia Alghaede Axis is the real axis of evil.

China is activating old US plan. USN wanted to build the base in Chahbahar.

China has signed lots of oil deals with Iran that is Plan 1.

Plan 2 is to take Iran Baluchestan oil fields if US attacks Iran.

[Kermanshah1]

England, China, Pakistan, Iran, Lebenon, H Bolah, Palestine, Hamas, Sudan

are Encircling the Middle East.

Pakistan Taleban Saudi Arabia Alghaede Axis is the real axis of evil.

China is activating old US plan. USN wanted to build the base in Chahbahar.

China has signed lots of oil deals with Iran that is Plan 1.

Plan 2 is to take Iran Baluchestan oil fields if US attacks Iran.

Look I believe Iran can beat the US if they attack, so if Iran can beat the US what chance would China have. They don't even have an aircraft carrier! without air-support their forces will be massacred. BTW it's beter to have China there than to have the US there. And have you hered of Irans military aliance with India against Pakistan.

[stormbringa]

Is it possible that recent talks about Irans aquisition of Pantsyr SAM systems have anything to do with this new destroyer. I guess they could be used on it as a primary air defence system.

[kaiser_tr]

i think launching new destroyers are not the best idea for now.they will be nothing more than easy targets for usa in a conflict.

plus i dont think that iran has the potential to produce a decent destroyer.iran should focus on air defence more than their seas.it cant win at the seas against usa

[Kermanshah1]

i think launching new destroyers are not the best idea for now.they will be nothing more than easy targets for usa in a conflict.

plus i dont think that iran has the potential to produce a decent destroyer.iran should focus on air defence more than their seas.it cant win at the seas against usa

Oh yes they can win at sea, but not with these sips. First they should not use their 3 Alvand class frigates, their 2 Moudge class frigates or their 2 Bayandor class corvettes and specially not their 1940s destroyers wich are antique. No Iran should close the straight with subs and mines (make more subs, they got 9, 4 self-made) when the straight is closed the US can't deploy more ships to the gulf so Iran sends in thier smaller vessels, thier 22 missile boats (not sure about how many are in the Caspian, at least one is), thier 150 patroll boats and thier 200 smaller craft, now the IRGC sends thier navy wich is 1500 ships. This will be enough, Iran loads them full with Fajr-3 ballistic missiles, these missiles are small and you can load hundreds in small boats, they split in 3 so Iran fires about 20 from each ship the US has had it, Iran has confirmed from their wargams that they can with thier missiles at the coast sink even large warships with a shot from them, so use them. If Iran gets rid of the 2 Air-craft carriers, sinks, damages badly, captures them or makes thier flight deck inoperatable it would mean they can sent out their planes. And wo Iran wins.

[kaiser_tr]

hmm you are suggesting that, iran should attack to aegis equipped u.s destroyers with patrol boat.have you ever thought about the radar range of these destroyers? probably none of the iranian boats won be able to fire a single rocket before they got shot

[Kermanshah1]

hmm you are suggesting that, iran should attack to aegis equipped u.s destroyers with patrol boat.have you ever thought about the radar range of these destroyers? probably none of the iranian boats won be able to fire a single rocket before they got shot

Look, the Fajr-3 ballistic missile has arange of 2500. They could also just fire them from out Iran.

[kaiser_tr]

a patrol boat firing ballistic missile...how will that be:)

[Kermanshah1]

a patrol boat firing ballistic missile...how will that be:)

They are made for ships.

[kaiser_tr]

then it cant have a range of 2500km

and if it did those small patrol boats cant have radars to scan such a big area.

[Kermanshah1]

then it cant have a range of 2500km

and if it did those small patrol boats cant have radars to scan such a big area.

Look it isn't only for ships, it has a range of 2500 and is to be fired from of Iran but it can also be fired from ships.

[Jadeite]

Look it isn't only for ships, it has a range of 2500 and is to be fired from of Iran but it can also be fired from ships.

The Fajr 3 is a third generation Katyusha, and only has a range of 45 km. Multiple sources confirm this.

Ballistic missiles are also useless vs moving targets anyway, given that they have no terminal maneuvering capability, nor do they mount any electronic countermeasures. Easy prey for defenses.

[Kermanshah1]

The Fajr 3 is a third generation Katyusha, and only has a range of 45 km. Multiple sources confirm this.

Ballistic missiles are also useless vs moving targets anyway, given that they have no terminal maneuvering capability, nor do they mount any electronic countermeasures. Easy prey for defenses.

True, the Fajr-3 is a third generation Katyusha, but there are 2 Fajr-3s, it is important not to mic them up, there is the Fajr-3 artillery rocket a third generation Katyusha and the Fajr-3 balistic missile, a medium range ballistic missile.

[rabs]

Ballistic missiles are also useless vs moving targets anyway, given that they have no terminal maneuvering capability, nor do they mount any electronic countermeasures.

Pardon? Terminal interception is kinda difficult, and I don't even think we have any means of doing it at sea, SM-3 isn't designed for that. I'm really not sure where your going with that.

[Jadeite]

Pardon? Terminal interception is kinda difficult, and I don't even think we have any means of doing it at sea, SM-3 isn't designed for that. I'm really not sure where your going with that.

No, it isn't. Ballistic missile interception has been possible ever since the 70s. The Russians have a working ABM system ringing Moscow, and the US tested several successful ABMs such as Zeus, Spartan, and Sprint. They even scored direct hits (not just proximity intercepts with explosives) and this was decades ago. Ballistic missiles will probably be completely obsolete within a decade or two. Quite frankly, they're going to be useless against anything but a big, stationary and undefended target, and a carrier battle group is none of those.


True, the Fajr-3 is a third generation Katyusha, but there are 2 Fajr-3s, it is important not to mic them up, there is the Fajr-3 artillery rocket a third generation Katyusha and the Fajr-3 balistic missile, a medium range ballistic missile.

Then prove that the second type is capable of being launched by a speed boat.

[Kermanshah1]

Then prove that the second type is capable of being launched by a speed boat.

It isn't, but it is launchable via missile boats.

[rabs]

No, it isn't. Ballistic missile interception has been possible ever since the 70s. The Russians have a working ABM system ringing Moscow, and the US tested several successful ABMs such as Zeus, Spartan, and Sprint. They even scored direct hits (not just proximity intercepts with explosives) and this was decades ago. Ballistic missiles will probably be completely obsolete within a decade or two. Quite frankly, they're going to be useless against anything but a big, stationary and undefended target, and a carrier battle group is none of those.


I don't know why in the world we are investing so much in ABM defense when it was so easy in the 60s. I agree that BMs are near useless against a maneuvering carrier but the thought they could simply be knocked out of the air like little toys is bit far reaching.

[Kermanshah1]

I don't know why in the world we are investing so much in ABM defense when it was so easy in the 60s. I agree that BMs are near useless against a maneuvering carrier but the thought they could simply be knocked out of the air like little toys is bit far reaching.

The Kowsar missile has remote controll stearing.

[rabs]

What the heck does that have to do with anything, we are talking about Ballistic missiles.

[Jadeite]

I don't know why in the world we are investing so much in ABM defense when it was so easy in the 60s. I agree that BMs are near useless against a maneuvering carrier but the thought they could simply be knocked out of the air like little toys is bit far reaching.

Because the US scrapped all of its ABM tech thanks to that treaty. We're starting over again now, and with brand new technology rather than the incremental improvements that the Russians did for theirs. Ours is also a multi-layered defense strategy, encompassing sea, air, and ground ABM assets rather than purely ground based. And yes, they can and were knocked out of the air quite easily. Out of 64 live fire intercept tests, Nike Zeus scored 56 successful intercepts, giving it an 87% success rate. This was back during the Cold War as well.

[me31fm]

I'd be surprised if this would be an actual destroyer in terms of tonnage and capabilities (AA & ASW). It would be odd to have just a single ship above 5,000 tons with no proper frigates for escort.

Of course I have realised that people often seem to mix the terms corvette, frigate and destoryer.

[JEskandari]

England, China, Pakistan, Iran, Lebenon, H Bolah, Palestine, Hamas, Sudan

are Encircling the Middle East.

Pakistan Taleban Saudi Arabia Alghaede Axis is the real axis of evil.

China is activating old US plan. USN wanted to build the base in Chahbahar.

China has signed lots of oil deals with Iran that is Plan 1.

Plan 2 is to take Iran Baluchestan oil fields if US attacks Iran.
Iran Baluchistan Oil field !?

[JEskandari]

They are made for ships.
who said Fajr-3 is made for ships.Its a ballistic missile which must be fired from land .

[JEskandari]

then it cant have a range of 2500km

and if it did those small patrol boats cant have radars to scan such a big area.
there is no ship that can scan such area in the world.

[JEskandari]

The Kowsar missile has remote controll stearing.
kowsar is not ballistic it's anti ship cruise missile .

[Kermanshah1]

kowsar is not ballistic it's anti ship cruise missile .

So they can use it, it would be bettter to hit US ships with.

[jawwal]

So they can use it, it would be bettter to hit US ships with.

I donot believe it is accurate enough to hit a moving targets.

[Vladimir80]

I donot believe it is accurate enough to hit a moving targets.

No ballistic missiles have that capability yet. China is trying to arm SRBMs with tactical nukes to take out carriers though. Good luck with that!

[Kermanshah1]

No ballistic missiles have that capability yet. China is trying to arm SRBMs with tactical nukes to take out carriers though. Good luck with that!

They can use the Kowsar surface to sea missile, it has remote controll stearing.

[Mujahid786]

this would give the iranian navy the much needed boost

[Xenostrike 06]

did Iranian Posses any Yakhonts or Moskit (SS-N-22 Sunburn) :) It would add even more powerful boost :smile1:

[jawwal]

No ballistic missiles have that capability yet. China is trying to arm SRBMs with tactical nukes to take out carriers though. Good luck with that!

Too bad for all these poor fish, knocking out a whole area to sink few ships, not to mention open nuclear war...

[jawwal]

did Iranian Posses any Yakhonts or Moskit (SS-N-22 Sunburn) :) It would add even more powerful boost :smile1:

Most reports states that iran has them, no reports on numbers though.

[Xenostrike 06]

Thanks...for the answer :biggrin1:

[Kermanshah1]

Most reports states that iran has them, no reports on numbers though.

Hopefully they got a lot.

[Xenostrike 06]

and of course Hidden Giving a second chance strike capability....if they're getting outpowered

[jawwal]

Hopefully they got a lot.

Iran seems to favor the hobby of reverse engineering,,:biggrin1:
Russia feels threatened, such missiles would find their ways to iran much easier than before.
Iran tested a brand new anti ship missiles few months ago, stated it was a total success with exceptional results, but did not provide any details about it except that it is long range missile, and highly accurate and extremely hard to jam.
Makes u wonder what its origin.

[jawwal]

Thanks...for the answer :biggrin1:

Welcome friend..

http://judicial-inc.biz/Sunburn_Missile.htm
http://www.rense.com/general59/theSunburniransawesome.htm
http://www.viewzone.com/iran/iran.folly.html

[Kermanshah1]

Iran seems to favor the hobby of reverse engineering,,:biggrin1:
Russia feels threatened, such missiles would find their ways to iran much easier than before.
Iran tested a brand new anti ship missiles few months ago, stated it was a total success with exceptional results, but did not provide any details about it except that it is long range missile, and highly accurate and extremely hard to jam.
Makes u wonder what its origin.

The Fajr-3 ballistic missile is also a succes with exceptional results, I read about it, if what they say about it is true: That is is radar avading, that it avades anti-missiles and that it splits in 3 parts wich all 3 are able to inpipendently hit their own target (they all 3 can hit a different one). It's range is unknow but it is Irans most advance missile.

[Xenostrike 06]

The Fajr-3 ballistic missile is also a succes with exceptional results, I read about it, if what they say about it is true: That is is radar avading, that it avades anti-missiles and that it splits in 3 parts wich all 3 are able to inpipendently hit their own target (they all 3 can hit a different one). It's range is unknow but it is Irans most advance missile.

Hmm Multi Warhead Missile..yep may pose exceptional accuracy than single Warhead which suspectible to AEGIS interception :wub2: ..beside if launched in Barrage..would be a serious pain in the *** to intercept them

and about Reverse engineering..well Russian won't bother if theirs get "reversed"..Chinese did that sooo many times..starts from MIG-19 till S-300 SAM system and J-11 that clearly LOOK ALIKE Su-27 Flanker

[Kermanshah1]

Hmm Multi Warhead Missile..yep may pose exceptional accuracy than single Warhead which suspectible to AEGIS interception :wub2: ..beside if launched in Barrage..would be a serious pain in the *** to intercept them

and about Reverse engineering..well Russian won't bother if theirs get "reversed"..Chinese did that sooo many times..starts from MIG-19 till S-300 SAM system and J-11 that clearly LOOK ALIKE Su-27 Flanker

Yeah and these things can hit Europe...

[Xenostrike 06]

Yeah and these things can hit Europe...

I think there's no need to hit Europe with that thing...Otherwise..someone would be happy if its happened...i believe you know who

Just use it for a self defense :wub2: and Parade :wub2:

[JEskandari]

Hmm Multi Warhead Missile..yep may pose exceptional accuracy than single Warhead which suspectible to AEGIS interception :wub2: ..beside if launched in Barrage..would be a serious pain in the *** to intercept them

and about Reverse engineering..well Russian won't bother if theirs get "reversed"..Chinese did that sooo many times..starts from MIG-19 till S-300 SAM system and J-11 that clearly LOOK ALIKE Su-27 Flanker
saeqe look alike f-5 but its very different ,being alike wont mean being the same.
about reverse engineering i wont think anybody like others reverse engineer their equipment without their approval.

[Kermanshah1]

saeqe look alike f-5 but its very different ,being alike wont mean being the same.
about reverse engineering i wont think anybody like others reverse engineer their equipment without their approval.

Yes and the Shafaq might be based on a Russian trainer but not in a bad way as people here always use to say Irans military is bad. It is based on it yes but this is a fighter version and so it isn't a russian trainer but an Iranian fighter. Also it is based on the YF-17.

[Xenostrike 06]

Yes and the Shafaq might be based on a Russian trainer but not in a bad way as people here always use to say Irans military is bad. It is based on it yes but this is a fighter version and so it isn't a russian trainer but an Iranian fighter. Also it is based on the YF-17.


What..so that's why this forum has such "harsh environment" for discussion,especially when talking about Iran Military's capability..
don't worry i will avoid using Offensive gestures..and try to make opinion as objective as posible

anyway..i see Shafaq has similarities with Russian's I-2000 ,and i heard it's a Semi-Stealth are that true ? :yes2:

[Kermanshah1]

What..so that's why this forum has such "harsh environment" for discussion,especially when talking about Iran Military's capability..
don't worry i will avoid using Offensive gestures..and try to make opinion as objective as posible

anyway..i see Shafaq has similarities with Russian's I-2000 ,and i heard it's a Semi-Stealth are that true ? :yes2:

Yes it has. and it is Irans first 4th generation fighter, same generation as the F-16. Pretty good isn't it.

[ironbar]

this thread is about iran destroyer so keep on the subject
when is this so called destroyer going to be launched??

[Kermanshah1]

this thread is about iran destroyer so keep on the subject
when is this so called destroyer going to be launched??

1 has already been launched and is also already completed, the second is under construction.

So the Moudge 1 is in service and the Moudge 2 is either fitting out or still being built (I believe it's still being built since they started making it 23 Feb 2007).

[Xenostrike 06]

and What this Destroyer can do ? any ability to Carry Long range Anti ship Missiles ?

Anti Air and Anti Submarine ?

[Kermanshah1]

and What this Destroyer can do ? any ability to Carry Long range Anti ship Missiles ?

Anti Air and Anti Submarine ?

This is what they said about it: This ship is equipped with torpedoes and electronic warfare devices.

Here are the figures:

Dimensions:

Length: 94.00 m
Beam: 10.00 m
Draught: 3.10 m

Displacement:

Moudge1: 1,400 tons
Moudge2: 1,420 tons

Armament

4 x C-802 (or maybe improved C-803) anti-ship missiles or 4 x HY-2 (CSSC-3)
1 × 76 mm Fajr-27 naval gun
1 x twin 37 mm AAA
4-8 × HQ-7

Crew: 120-140
Maximum speed:

Moudge1: 28 knots
Moudge2: 30 knots
(slower than the Alvand class because this one works on diesel)

Propulsion:

2 10,000 hp engines
4 diesel generators
4 x 550 kW

[ironbar]

more farsi farce
first of all this isnt a destroyer its a corvette its way too small to be considered a destroyer
second it is nothing more that a re-named british alvand class frigate the was purchased during the time of the shah

[Kermanshah1]

more farsi farce
first of all this isnt a destroyer its a corvette its way too small to be considered a destroyer


Wrong. Though I know it is not a destroyer it is not a Corvette either. This ship is a frigate. However because of it being a quite light frigate it is also somethimes called a Corvette but this is wrong.

BTW. There have been destroyers that weighed even less.


second it is nothing more that a re-named british alvand class frigate the was purchased during the time of the shah

No, it is different in a lot of ways. Different speed, fuel, It has a helicopter landing pad, beter radars and many more differences. Although it is roughly the same size and weight this one is more advanced.

And the most important thing is: it is Iranian made! Alvand, Alborz, Sabalan and Sahand were bought but Moudge1 and Moudge2 are built in Iran and that is a great achievement. While other nations buy them we make them and we will make even better ones in the future.

Here is a picture:
http://www.irandefence.net/gallery/data/500/Moudge.jpg

[Simple Bubba]

Here's my take on it... Mowaj, is indigenous corvette. That is essentially a reverse engineered Vosper Mk 5 (Alvand Class) built from scratch by Iran which should be reconized as an achievement.

...but not at the level of a "western" built corvette... again my two bits.

here's a old google earth pic showing the three Avland class (Vosper mk5 FFL) and the Mowaj.

[jamsadeghi]

I think this is more of a tech. demonstrator/tester than anything else....basically i dont expect this particular ship to play any vital role in a future US-iran conflict...

[Kermanshah1]

Here's my take on it... Mowaj, is indigenous corvette. That is essentially a reverse engineered Vosper Mk 5 (Alvand Class) built from scratch by Iran which should be reconized as an achievement.

...but not at the level of a "western" built corvette... again my two bits.

here's a old google earth pic showing the three Avland class (Vosper mk5 FFL) and the Mowaj.

The Moudge is a frigate, not a corvette.