Two US sailors shot dead in Bahrain

[PARSI PRIDE]

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=28123&sectionid=351020205
Two American sailors have been shot dead and one has been critically wounded at the US navy base in Bahrain, a navy statement said.

There were no indications that non-US citizens were involved, a navy spokeswoman added.

The shootings took place at about 5 a.m. (0200 GMT), the navy said in a statement, adding they were investigating the incident.

The navy gave no explanation for the shootings, which took place in the base's barracks, and said the names of the sailors were being withheld.

No further information was immediately available.

The attack comes after Bahrain earlier this month charged four nationals with belonging to a banned organization, the al-Qaeda network, following reports that a cell was plotting attacks against US targets.

[Ayyash]

Well, this is what happens when you station your troops all over the world, people tend to get pissed.

[rabs]

So your a moderator, that supports murder, how pleasant.

[Grutte Pier]

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=28123&sectionid=351020205

There were no indications that non-US citizens were involved, a navy spokeswoman added.

So now they're killing each other... :wub2:

[mustavaris]

So now they're killing each other... :wub2:

Crap happens, hundreds of thousands of young men and women at arms.. tells a lot that these incidents are this rare.

[mustavaris]

Well, this is what happens when you station your troops all over the world, people tend to get pissed.

What a nice attitude.

People + guns = gun related deaths.

I am damn sure that your well armed homeland civilian Yankees kill relatively speaking more each other than these men and women at arms.

[payam]

http://www.presstv.ir/detail.aspx?id=28123&sectionid=351020205
Two American sailors have been shot dead and one has been critically wounded at the US navy base in Bahrain, a navy statement said.

There were no indications that non-US citizens were involved, a navy spokeswoman added.

The shootings took place at about 5 a.m. (0200 GMT), the navy said in a statement, adding they were investigating the incident.

The navy gave no explanation for the shootings, which took place in the base's barracks, and said the names of the sailors were being withheld.

No further information was immediately available.

The attack comes after Bahrain earlier this month charged four nationals with belonging to a banned organization, the al-Qaeda network, following reports that a cell was plotting attacks against US targets.


Bismillah

Not a big deal,The death of some mercenary.Just like the other ones in iraq,fighting for money or thier green cards...
Hope to see the death of more murderers.

[Ayyash]

So your a moderator, that supports murder, how pleasant.

Not supporting murder, just observing that they cant expect any different when you station troops all over the world, thats all there is to it.

[indianguy]

By Suvendrini Kakuchi

TOKYO, Jan 31 (IPS) - Japan's plans to boost its defence capability with the support of the United States is being opposed by women's rights activists who say that U.S. military bases in this country are a danger to women who live in their vicinities.

More than a hundred women activists and their supporters, including Korean anti-American base groups, held a meeting on Monday night to mark the first anniversary of the murder of a 56-year-old woman who was robbed and killed by an American sailor on January 2006, close to Camp Zama in Yokusuka, Kanagawa prefecture, a suburb of Tokyo.

Reiko Ashizawa, one of the organisers, blamed "sheer lack of respect for Asian women in the U.S. military and the Japanese government as the root cause of the problem.''

‘'We are up against a culture where women's rights are considered secondary. Our demonstration drew attention to this situation,'' she told IPS.

Activists say they are ready to fight jointly with their counterparts in Asia -- particularly in the Philippines and South Korea -- as Tokyo prepares to strengthen collaboration with the U.S. military in Japan.

Already Ashizawa has joined other activists to collect signatures and raise funds for a Filipina rape victim. The perpetrator was convicted in December, but was afterwards controversially removed to custody within the premises of the U.S. embassy in Manila under the visiting forces agreement (VFA) between the two countries.

According to the Gabriella Women's Party in the Philippines there were 82 cases of sexual abuse committed against women and 15 cases against children by U.S. servicemen before the U.S. Bases Agreement, signed in 1947, was finally terminated in September 1991.

Criminal acts and cases of sexual abuse, including the rape of a 12-year-old Japanese girl by three Marines in 1995, resulted in the relocation of the U.S. base within Okinawa prefecture. The U.S. currently maintains 50,000 troops on Japanese soil.

Plans have been passed in the Diet (parliament) that provides for the deployment of carrier-based fighter jets in Okinawa and the setting up of a new U.S. radar system for ballistic missile defence on the island.

Suzuyo Takasato, a leading activist in Okinawa, heads one of several movements that record in detail instances of violence committed by U.S. military personnel on women in Japan.

Takasato points to a survey by activists who scoured newspapers and other publications and also conducted their own research, to find at least six cases of serious crimes perpetrated against women that have led to arrests of U.S. servicemen stationed on Okinawa.

‘'The numbers could be much higher because women do not report every harassment that occurs,'' explained Takasato

One argument being advanced against U.S. bases in Japan by activists here is that they are contributing to the fear of abuse of women in other parts of Asia.

‘'The provision of bases on Okinawa for American military personnel make Japanese women feel guilty and they want to increase solidarity with activists from other parts of Asia that are protesting against violations by U.S. servicemen in their countries,'' Takasato told IPS.

Official records also indicate that crimes and other incidents involving U.S. military personnel and civilian employees stationed in Japan are rising, though documentation is weak.

Japan's defence agency, which was upgraded to the level of a ministry this month, has records that show 1,866 cases in 2004 and 2,079 cases in 2003 -- nearly 50 percent higher than a decade ago.

Traffic violations, robberies, rape and murder were reported. Under the U.S.-Japan Armed Forces Agreement, American soldiers arrested for crimes against local civilians can either be handed over to Japanese police or placed under U.S. custody but primacy is given to U.S. authority.

Protests against such protection go unheeded because of the official argument that U.S. bases are crucial for Japan's security. But women's rights activists and their supporters are not ready to buy that and say respect for women must come first.

http://www.care2.com/c2c/groups/disc.html?gpp=10186&pst=752190&archival=&posts=6

If such incidents have happened involving American soldiers with allies females even when there is no war .. what would happened with the females who are in war affected area's .

[mustavaris]

Not supporting murder, just observing that they cant expect any different when you station troops all over the world, thats all there is to it.

No it is not.

Check the homicide rates for US civilians when guns are involved and compare it to the homice rates among the US troopers.

[mustavaris]

Indianguy:

the rapes are serious issue, and I think that strong action is needed to take care of the incidents... but I am obliged to make a question: does the incredible low indigenous rate of rapes in Japanese society make this problem look worse than it is when comparing to the rest of the world? Of course, the Japanese have no duty to tolerate such behaviour on their soil and all the rapists should be thrown into jail for a looong time and if released, kicked out of the country for good, in my personal opinion that is the most serious violent crime which does not involve death. But.. is it as significant phenomenon in worldy scale as these Japanese news may show?

I could make a comparison, but I won´t...

[indianguy]

Indianguy:

the rapes are serious issue, and I think that strong action is needed to take care of the incidents... but I am obliged to make a question: does the incredible low indigenous rate of rapes in Japanese society make this problem look worse than it is when comparing to the rest of the world? Of course, the Japanese have no duty to tolerate such behaviour on their soil and all the rapists should be thrown into jail for a looong time and if released, kicked out of the country for good, in my personal opinion that is the most serious violent crime which does not involve death. But.. is it as significant phenomenon in worldy scale as these Japanese news may show?

I could make a comparison, but I won´t...

So in urs opinion the punishment for Rapes by soldiers should be what ?

[mustavaris]

So in urs opinion the punishment for Rapes by soldiers should be what ?

The Japanese should be allowed to punish them according to their laws, they are guests on foreign soil. And then if they are released, the Japanese should be able to say that these guys are never ever allowed again to step on Japanese soil. These soldiers are not diplomats with immunity.

[indianguy]

The Japanese should be allowed to punish them according to their laws, they are guests on foreign soil. And then if they are released, the Japanese should be able to say that these guys are never ever allowed again to step on Japanese soil. These soldiers are not diplomats with immunity.

Japanese and American are having agreements , in which its there that Japanese law can be tried on American soldiers in case of Rapes and murders , but no american soldier have been tried by Japanese Law ever .

I asked urs opionion ,what should be the punishment of rapes and murders by soldiers ?

[mustavaris]

Japanese and American are having agreements , in which its there that Japanese law can be tried on American soldiers in case of Rapes and murders , but no american soldier have been tried by Japanese Law ever .

I asked urs opionion ,what should be the punishment of rapes and murders by soldiers ?

Ah, personal opinion, not what ough to be done.

Well. Life long sentence for murder (that ought to be the only possible sentence if someone is sentenced for murder), and for rape... depending on the circumstances... kicking out of the military and Japan, at least 10..20 years in jail, heavy compensations and public defaming. If other violence had been used, many years more.

[Ayyash]

No it is not.

Check the homicide rates for US civilians when guns are involved and compare it to the homice rates among the US troopers.

Sorry, i dont understand, are you saying that US troops kill more, or the rate is higher in the USA?

[mustavaris]

Sorry, i dont understand, are you saying that US troops kill more, or the rate is higher in the USA?

I am pretty sure that the armed civvies kill each other more frequently in USA than the (wo)men at arms kill each other abroad.

[indianguy]

Ah, personal opinion, not what ough to be done.

Well. Life long sentence for murder (that ought to be the only possible sentence if someone is sentenced for murder), and for rape... depending on the circumstances... kicking out of the military and Japan, at least 10..20 years in jail, heavy compensations and public defaming. If other violence had been used, many years more.

In USA .. Capital Punishment is there and the last time U.S. Army Private was executed in 1961 for Rape and attempted Murder .

Civilian was executed rape and murder in 2003 .

If its kicking out of military then be sure that every second day there would be a rape by deserters. Dont u think so ?

Compensations .. So who is going to pay ? the rapist .. Forget it .

[mustavaris]

In USA .. Capital Punishment is there and the last time U.S. Army Private was executed in 1961 for Rape and attempted Murder .

Civilian was executed rape and murder in 2003 .

If its kicking out of military then be sure that every second day there would be a rape by deserters. Dont u think so ?

Compensations .. So who is going to pay ? the rapist .. Forget it .

Well.. you asked for personal opinion, and you got one. Not bothered now by actual punishments.

Kicking out means that you lose your rank and all gathered benefits. That is just one part of the punishment.

Compensations are paid by the criminal, his property is sold if needed, if he cannot pay, the employer (state) will pay but the compensation is turned into a jail term then, there are rules for that. At least up here.

[Ayyash]

I am pretty sure that the armed civvies kill each other more frequently in USA than the (wo)men at arms kill each other abroad.

Ah yes, my original statement, which rabs responded to was made under the assumption that it was a disgruntled national that killed the soldiers, that as opposed to another member of the armed forces.

[mustavaris]

And, forgot to say: I am against capital punishment.

Death is mercy, by dying you escape guilt and second thoughts and you are granted end of your suffering.. and if one believes in afterlife.. well, the god(s) can wait.

And you can never cancel capital punishment.

[indianguy]

Well.. you asked for personal opinion, and you got one. Not bothered now by actual punishments.

Kicking out means that you lose your rank and all gathered benefits. That is just one part of the punishment.

Compensations are paid by the criminal, his property is sold if needed, if he cannot pay, the employer (state) will pay but the compensation is turned into a jail term then, there are rules for that. At least up here.

How to understand this atleast up here ?

Do u mean that Compensations are paid only in West or what ?

[indianguy]

And, forgot to say: I am against capital punishment.

Death is mercy, by dying you escape guilt and second thoughts and you are granted end of your suffering.. and if one believes in afterlife.. well, the god(s) can wait.

And you can never cancel capital punishment.

Why Capital Punishment is there in USA ?

[mustavaris]

How to understand this atleast up here ?

Do u mean that Compensations are paid only in West or what ?

I mean that in certain crimes, the victim should be paid compensation. If the criminal cannot pay it, the state or employer (depending on the situation) has to pay it, but in such case the criminal gets extra jail term which is counted on the normal sentence.

[mustavaris]

Why Capital Punishment is there in USA ?

Barbarity? Stupidity? Thirst for blood & revenge?

Who cares, it is wrong and stupid, inefficent & expensive anyway.

The Americans can tell, if they like to.

In my lil´world, capital punishment has no place and serves no purpose.

[indianguy]

I mean that in certain crimes, the victim should be paid compensation. If the criminal cannot pay it, the state or employer (depending on the situation) has to pay it, but in such case the criminal gets extra jail term which is counted on the normal sentence.

"...If anyone kills a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he killed all people. And if anyone saves a life, it would be as if he saved the life of all people" (Qur'an 5:32).

Qur'an legislates the death penalty for murder, although forgiveness and compassion are strongly encouraged. The murder victim's family is given a choice to either insist on the death penalty, or to pardon the perpetrator and accept monetary compensation for their loss (2:178).

Compensation for Murder is there in Muslim world .

May be u were talking something like this .

"...Take not life, which God has made sacred, except by way of justice and law. Thus does He command you, so that you may learn wisdom" (6:151).

[mustavaris]

I am totally against capital punishment in justice system due to reasons I have already stated, and to add, I believe that the only situation when we have right to take human´s life is self defence or when we are defending other person´s life (in larger extend, in justified war). And only if we are threatened by serious, potentially lethal power.. and then it is our right to defend while we have to show restraint and have to do our best to defend with the least force needed to accomplish the task.

[indianguy]

I am totally against capital punishment in justice system due to reasons I have already stated, and to add, I believe that the only situation when we have right to take human´s life is self defence or when we are defending other person´s life (in larger extend, in justified war). And only if we are threatened by serious, potentially lethal power.. and then it is our right to defend while we have to show restraint and have to do our best to defend with the least force needed to accomplish the task.

U mean in self defence or defending some one else like in war .

Then what about the crimes within society ? How u r going to handle that .

Everyone cant defend themselves against Crime within societies , there should be some certain tougher laws to stop such crimes as murder , rapes and robbery.

[mustavaris]

U mean in self defence or defending some one else like in war .

Then what about the crimes within society ? How u r going to handle that .

Everyone cant defend themselves against Crime within societies , there should be some certain tougher laws to stop such crimes as murder , rapes and robbery.

Self defence works also on national level, in war.

Crimes are very often essentially social matters, poverty, cultural matters, substance abuse and so forth have to be tackled, while I also support strong punishments when someone steps over the line as I have already said. I support harsher punishments than the majority of the European punishments are now, but on the other hand.. I see that much of the criminal activity is created by socio-economical and cultural aspects so the punishments are like painkillers, affecting symptoms.. the cure is something else while the painkillers are also needed.

Punishments itself are not enough to stop crimes, comparison between US states which have capital punishment and which do not have pretty much prove this when someone insists that capital punishment scares potential criminals...

[Abbas]

I saw this story on the BBC and thought "there is no point posting this" because its just a social issue within the forces. they got shot, big deal.

[mustavaris]

I saw this story on the BBC and thought "there is no point posting this" because its just a social issue within the forces. they got shot, big deal.

You are right, but this thread developed into something more interesting...

And sorry for going for going off-topic... yet another time.

[indianguy]

Self defence works also on national level, in war.

Crimes are very often essentially social matters, poverty, cultural matters, substance abuse and so forth have to be tackled, while I also support strong punishments when someone steps over the line as I have already said. I support harsher punishments than the majority of the European punishments are now, but on the other hand.. I see that much of the criminal activity is created by socio-economical and cultural aspects so the punishments are like painkillers, affecting symptoms.. the cure is something else while the painkillers are also needed.

Punishments itself are not enough to stop crimes, comparison between US states which have capital punishment and which do not have pretty much prove this when someone insists that capital punishment scares potential criminals...

According to United States Department of Justice document Criminal Victimization in the United States, in the United States in 2005, 37,460 white females were sexually assaulted or raped by a black man, while between zero and ten black females were sexually assaulted or raped by a white man. There were overall 111,590 white victims of rape/sexual assault in 2005. In those 111,590 cases the offender was White in 44.5 percent of the cases and Black in 33.6 percent of the cases.

More than 67,000 cases of rape and sexual assaults against children were reported in 2000 in South Africa. Child welfare groups believe that the number of unreported incidents could be up to 10 times that number. A belief common to South Africa holds that sexual intercourse with a virgin will cure a man of HIV or Aids. South Africa has the highest number of HIV-positive citizens in the world. According to official figures, one in eight South Africans are infected with the virus. Edith Kriel, a social worker who helps child victims in the Eastern Cape, said: “Child abusers are often relatives of their victims - even their fathers and providers.”

[mustavaris]

According to United States Department of Justice document Criminal Victimization in the United States, in the United States in 2005, 37,460 white females were sexually assaulted or raped by a black man, while between zero and ten black females were sexually assaulted or raped by a white man. There were overall 111,590 white victims of rape/sexual assault in 2005. In those 111,590 cases the offender was White in 44.5 percent of the cases and Black in 33.6 percent of the cases.

More than 67,000 cases of rape and sexual assaults against children were reported in 2000 in South Africa. Child welfare groups believe that the number of unreported incidents could be up to 10 times that number. A belief common to South Africa holds that sexual intercourse with a virgin will cure a man of HIV or Aids. South Africa has the highest number of HIV-positive citizens in the world. According to official figures, one in eight South Africans are infected with the virus. Edith Kriel, a social worker who helps child victims in the Eastern Cape, said: “Child abusers are often relatives of their victims - even their fathers and providers.”

And what do you mean?

I am familair with this stuff... here foreigners make 2-2,6% of the population while they commit 25 - 30 % of the rapes.. so?

[JEskandari]

Indianguy:

the rapes are serious issue, and I think that strong action is needed to take care of the incidents... but I am obliged to make a question: does the incredible low indigenous rate of rapes in Japanese society make this problem look worse than it is when comparing to the rest of the world? Of course, the Japanese have no duty to tolerate such behaviour on their soil and all the rapists should be thrown into jail for a looong time and if released, kicked out of the country for good, in my personal opinion that is the most serious violent crime which does not involve death. But.. is it as significant phenomenon in worldy scale as these Japanese news may show?

I could make a comparison, but I won´t...
why jail them in Iran we hang them, last week we hang three at the same time.

[Mohmar 'Deathstrike']

What a nice attitude.

People + guns = gun related deaths.

I am damn sure that your well armed homeland civilian Yankees kill relatively speaking more each other than these men and women at arms.Probably because soldiers are trained better and when in military barracks, have no kids to keep the guns away from.So your a moderator, that supports murder, how pleasant.They were military sailors, therefore enemy combatants. Also, it was a "non-hostile" incident anyway.By Suvendrini Kakuchi

TOKYO, Jan 31 (IPS) - Japan's plans to boost its defence capability with the support of the United States is being opposed by women's rights activists who say that U.S. military bases in this country are a danger to women who live in their vicinities.

More than a hundred women activists and their supporters, including Korean anti-American base groups, held a meeting on Monday night to mark the first anniversary of the murder of a 56-year-old woman who was robbed and killed by an American sailor on January 2006, close to Camp Zama in Yokusuka, Kanagawa prefecture, a suburb of Tokyo.

Reiko Ashizawa, one of the organisers, blamed "sheer lack of respect for Asian women in the U.S. military and the Japanese government as the root cause of the problem.''

‘'We are up against a culture where women's rights are considered secondary. Our demonstration drew attention to this situation,'' she told IPS.

Activists say they are ready to fight jointly with their counterparts in Asia -- particularly in the Philippines and South Korea -- as Tokyo prepares to strengthen collaboration with the U.S. military in Japan.

Already Ashizawa has joined other activists to collect signatures and raise funds for a Filipina rape victim. The perpetrator was convicted in December, but was afterwards controversially removed to custody within the premises of the U.S. embassy in Manila under the visiting forces agreement (VFA) between the two countries.

According to the Gabriella Women's Party in the Philippines there were 82 cases of sexual abuse committed against women and 15 cases against children by U.S. servicemen before the U.S. Bases Agreement, signed in 1947, was finally terminated in September 1991.

Criminal acts and cases of sexual abuse, including the rape of a 12-year-old Japanese girl by three Marines in 1995, resulted in the relocation of the U.S. base within Okinawa prefecture. The U.S. currently maintains 50,000 troops on Japanese soil.

Plans have been passed in the Diet (parliament) that provides for the deployment of carrier-based fighter jets in Okinawa and the setting up of a new U.S. radar system for ballistic missile defence on the island.

Suzuyo Takasato, a leading activist in Okinawa, heads one of several movements that record in detail instances of violence committed by U.S. military personnel on women in Japan.

Takasato points to a survey by activists who scoured newspapers and other publications and also conducted their own research, to find at least six cases of serious crimes perpetrated against women that have led to arrests of U.S. servicemen stationed on Okinawa.

‘'The numbers could be much higher because women do not report every harassment that occurs,'' explained Takasato

One argument being advanced against U.S. bases in Japan by activists here is that they are contributing to the fear of abuse of women in other parts of Asia.

‘'The provision of bases on Okinawa for American military personnel make Japanese women feel guilty and they want to increase solidarity with activists from other parts of Asia that are protesting against violations by U.S. servicemen in their countries,'' Takasato told IPS.

Official records also indicate that crimes and other incidents involving U.S. military personnel and civilian employees stationed in Japan are rising, though documentation is weak.

Japan's defence agency, which was upgraded to the level of a ministry this month, has records that show 1,866 cases in 2004 and 2,079 cases in 2003 -- nearly 50 percent higher than a decade ago.

Traffic violations, robberies, rape and murder were reported. Under the U.S.-Japan Armed Forces Agreement, American soldiers arrested for crimes against local civilians can either be handed over to Japanese police or placed under U.S. custody but primacy is given to U.S. authority.

Protests against such protection go unheeded because of the official argument that U.S. bases are crucial for Japan's security. But women's rights activists and their supporters are not ready to buy that and say respect for women must come first.

http://www.care2.com/c2c/groups/disc.html?gpp=10186&pst=752190&archival=&posts=6

If such incidents have happened involving American soldiers with allies females even when there is no war .. what would happened with the females who are in war affected area's .What I suggest is that these activists form a global information network that spans all countries that have foreign bases in them. They should try to identify perpetrators and send their data to all correspondents. If a perpetrator is ever spotted again, street justice is to be exerted since they are immune to the regular kind.These soldiers are not diplomats with immunity.They may not be diplomats, but they are immune to the laws of their host country. The US manages to push thru this demand in all countries it has troops in.
Punishments itself are not enough to stop crimes, comparison between US states which have capital punishment and which do not have pretty much prove this when someone insists that capital punishment scares potential criminals...Yep. When someone commits premeditated murder, they do it because they think they can get away with it. Death penalty isn't going to alter that. If someone commits murder because they go nuts, they have gone nuts and won't care about the death penalty in that instant.

Re: The original aritcle:
My hypothesis is that they got into a rather heated argument and shot each other.

[mustavaris]

why jail them in Iran we hang them, last week we hang three at the same time.

Read my previous posts, capital punishment is stupid, dangerous and wrong way to tackle this problem... and if we hung all the rapists, we would be said to be racists..

But I know damn well that our system does not work, rapes up 55% during the first half of this year, robberies 25 %. Welcome to Finland.

[mustavaris]

What I suggest is that these activists form a global information network that spans all countries that have foreign bases in them. They should try to identify perpetrators and send their data to all correspondents. If a perpetrator is ever spotted again, street justice is to be exerted since they are immune to the regular kind...

Well, that would lead into more random violence.

They may not be diplomats, but they are immune to the laws of their host country. The US manages to push thru this demand in all countries it has troops in..

That is the fact, but it is wrong.

[indianguy]

I saw this story on the BBC and thought "there is no point posting this" because its just a social issue within the forces. they got shot, big deal.

Studies estimate that one in every three U.S. women face rape or attempted rape at least once in their lives. Of those raped, 61 percent are under the age of eighteen. The incidence of rape is so great that Health and Human Services Secretary Donna Shalala has declared "We must recognize violence against women as a significant social problem."

Soldiers are also part of societies , who came out of societies to serve their nation . some in the name of patrotism and some for benifts in edcuation and getting nationality.

I think if societies are based more on family values then soldiers would change themselves .. and before committing crimes such as rapes and murder , soldiers will think about their families ..

Culture and societies in real pay the biggest role

[mustavaris]

Culture and societies in real pay the biggest role

That is very true.