Has god us to hurt ourselves???????

[Vinay]

Now, I will tread very carefully. I dont want to offend anyboby.

But i am disturbed by something.

In the hindu customs (some of them, not all!!!!!!!), Shia Islam etc.... people make themselves bleed to show their devotion to God.
All I am asking is is that necessary?

I know it is to show devotion. But the way I think of it, God wants us to be healthy. and if we hurt ourselves, we are not. So I want to hear some other thots.

But please dont abuse.

[Vinay]

Hence a Non-Shia will view self flagellation as WEIRD and STUPID, disgusting,without knowing our intention



I consider Self flagellation to be an innovation but a good innovation since it is allowed.


^^^ Hope you got your answer regarding the shia Rituals


First off, I stick to my point of view and you yours. But i know there are 6 billion points of view in the world.

Non shia or non muslims who pooh pooh muslim customs ARE THEMSELVES STUPID!!!!

There are many people who do it and not just for religios reasons , for protests, for trade union disputes etc.
I consider Self flagellation to be an innovation but a good innovation since it is allowed.
Like i said, your view, but coundnt Islam be modernised and reformed just like the other religions could????

[Abbas]

Matam is part of our way of mourning and grieving death of our Imams who were butchered in the most in-humane way on ashoura. not even the youngest children were spared that day.

in regards to the current day, i have my opinion and so do others.

personally heres my stand and ameer im interested in yours too.

I believe matam is a way of sharing grief and sorrow, however i am not in agree with use of chains (zanjeer) as they do in pakistan, and use of sword as they do in lebanon, syria and iraq.

infact my friend told me that many marj3a including sistani have banned that action and made it haraam? is that true ameer? (reason being that in todays society it is used as propaganda to turn people against us, rather than turn people to us)

Interestingly the shedding of blood is forbidden in Iran? you can use zanjeer but they type that only has a chain with no knife. (i witnessed this 15yrs ago, maybe things have changed now)

Thank you

[Abbas]

ameer, although its in URDU, pls listen and give me ur thoughts...

i can translate it for u too.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=IUQA5MEX

[Amir]

Like i said, your view, but coundnt Islam be modernised and reformed just like the other religions could????

chapter 2, verse 2)
This is the Book (Qur'an) wherein there is no doubt."
*"Have not the unbelievers considered that if it were from other than Allah, it would contain many contradictions?"
* "Allah shall show them the Signs within themselves and on the farthest horizons."
* "If you are in doubt about it, bring a book like it."


System of Islam is Perfect. The path is clear( Obey Quran and Prophet's Sunnah(Tradition).
Before Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) died, He said I left two things for my Ummah One is Quran and the other is my Ahlul Bayt (pbut)

Judaism and Christianity are the corpses of the past dynamic live Abrahamic Religions, Islam is the new challenge for the West

Can you tell me (few Examples) what you think should reform in Islam ?

[Vinay]

chapter 2, verse 2)
Can you tell me (few Examples) what you think should reform in Islam ?

Buddy. it is not only Islam that has to be modernized IMO, but all religions including the majority one of my country Hinduism.
I dont know why,but all countris dont follow the same Islam.

Some are very strict like Saudi
Some are relaxed like Malaysia

I think it depends on the societies
like the forced covering of some women (I think niqab), male dominance,
the "elders" will say it is against our religion to "change".

Coming to the religion itself i can quote you one example.
calling others "unbeilievers" or "infidels" who are non muslims.
Some say that Islam is the only religion and others are infidels.
I am very sure, there are people like that in India too (Hindus).
But dont you think it has to change?
After all, Islam is about peace and tolerence

[Amir]

Buddy. it is not only Islam that has to be modernized IMO, but all religions including the majority one of my country Hinduism.

Let's talk in General. >>> Quran and Hadith
There are Many things that Islamic countries do that is against Islam, Like Saudi Government

Do you think that there is a verse in Quran that Contradict with Today's world ?

[Amir]

ameer, although its in URDU, pls listen and give me ur thoughts...

i can translate it for u too.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=IUQA5MEX

Thanks, I like Urdu Azadaris more than Arabics, because Urdu is more similar to Farsi

[Vinay]

Let's talk in General. >>> Quran and Hadith
There are Many things that Islamic countries do that is against Islam, Like Saudi Government

Do you think that there is a verse in Quran that Contradict with Today's world ?

I am happy you understood me.

I am not an expert in the holy Quran nor have I read any of the religious books.
So you will have to excuse me on that.

Do you think that there is a verse in Quran that Contradict with Today's world ?

Look, what I am trying to say is even tho Islam is such a great religion and all that, what counts is the way it is interpreted
in socities, in western,, indian, israeli, malaysian........, you will find extreme elements of Islam hijacking the great religion and interpreting it in their own way.

like that Sadr chap or the Hamas militants
they dont care about the true Islam!
the care only about their distorted version of Islam.

[Amir]

Look, what I am trying to say is even tho Islam is such a great religion and all that, what counts is the way it is interpreted
.

you are right about that